Hello everyone!
Here I am again with another battle report. In this game I did not participate as a player, but rather, watched and acted as the umpire of a game. It was 400 points of Romans VS Britons, and a 2 vs 2 battles. Graham and newcomer James were the Britons and Tim H and newcomer Gus were the Early Roman Imperial forces.
We played at the Ogres Den Gaming Club in Calgary, Alberta. There was quite a lot of space, and we were able to put two large 6x4 feet tables together, and had lots of room to put soldiers, rulebooks and extras on the sides. Graham made the army lists, and I set up the terrain. In this game there was a single road running down the middle of the game board and I deemed forests to be impassible, block line of sight, and the only way to access them was to break into open order.
All Generals had a leadership of 9 this game. I do believe they were both given a leadership of 9 for free.
I wanted to film this game, but the background noise in the Den was quite noisy and the game lasted much longer than I think intended!
Here's the army lists:
Britons! 400 points
Division 1 with the General LD 9 (controlled by James)
- 2 Warbands
- 1 Fanatic Warband
- 2 Light Chariot units
- 1 Light Cavalry standard sized
- 2 small skirmish units with slingsDivision 2 with commander ld 8 (controlled by Graham)
- 1 Large Warband
- 2 warbands
- 2 light chariot units
- 1 medium cavalry
- 1 small skirmish unit with slings
Imperial Romans! 399 points
Division 1 with General LD 9 (controlled by Tim)
- 1 Veteran Legionnaires
- 2 legionnaire units
- 1 Medium Auxiliary spear unit
- 1 Medium auxiliary archer unit
- 1 skorpion
Division 2 with Commander Ld 8 (Gus)
- 3 units of legionnaires
- 1 medium aux unit of spears
- 1 medium aux unit of archers
- An Elephant
- One unit slings with skirmishers
For most of the game I hung out on the side that Gus and James were playing on, and most photos are taken from that angle, though I did manage to go to the side at times. I'll have to say, since we had two new players that there were some parts that we got stumped on and some rules were not made clear. I was expecting this. However, it's easy to assume everyone gets the rules after explaining them once when really in this sort of large scaled game you really need to go through the rules multiple times to fathom them. That and it is easy to forget some vital points of the game after you've played a few times, and I blame myself on some parts that may have left Gus and James confused and lost while playing. Hopefully next time I do a demo or invite new players that are interested in Hail Caesar! I can just be a little more clear on basic rules and instructions!
I'd also say there wasn't much need for Umpiring. We all pitched in and put our own two cents into it.. lets just say I was a spectator that had the rulebook and break test charts and other cheat sheets printed up!
Finally, since I was not in the game, I will not remember as many details, nor what happened on what turn as I would have normally if I had been playing. So I will try to recollect what I can from the photos presented and walk through the battle!
My spot at the side, with rulebook and cheat sheets ready.
Lots of table space this time! Threw two tables together and it was an awesome amount of space. The two sides set up.
The Roman starting line. Gus was on the right, Tim on the Roman left. Here on the first turn Gus sends his slingers into the trees, and Tim places his auxiliary archers in the wood on his side of the field.
James set his stuff up on the left side of the field. There was a lot more space between the Briton's two divisions.
Graham's forces.. you can see that massive warband on the far right!
Graham moves forth, sending his skirmishers up closer to hopefully pelt some Roman archers that are hiding in the trees.
James tactics differ somewhat, as he splits his forces on either side of the General...
Those Roman skirmishers get ready to take to the trees to fend off whatever gets near them.
Elephant's got the flank, obviously.
Here you can see the Roman lines have shifted somewhat to face James' flanking position. Gus has put some of his forces at an angle , seeing that James had split his division into two.
Graham's tactics were what I'd expect the barbarians to do.. .. forwards!
Romans at the ready. They hold up the gap between the board edge and tree line.
I should mention that shots were fired on either sides, and the skorpion and archers did some decent hitting, but nothing spectacular enough to cause any break tests! The odd unit in the game did give ground or hold disordered.
Here you can see the large warband has backed off.. shooting was doing its job and holding the barbarians at bay!
James puts his skirmishers close to the Roman lines and starts to pelt stones at the legions. At one point, the slingers are able to drive back the elephant! Gus had his skirmishers well placed in the forest, and remained there all game and hit various targets. Good use of the only Roman skirmish unit.
Some orders were failed here I believe!
The first melee begins! Fanatics supported by Cavalrymen slam into the Roman line on Gus' side!
The movement carries on, shots continue to be fired.. and the Britons edge in closer. You can see the elephant had to give ground to sling fire... .. Gus spread out his forces to make up the lost space that the elephant had left.
Combat ensues, and the initial fighting ended up being a win for the Fanatics, but the Romans refused to give ground right off the first go.
You'll also notice that Graham's forces approach the far side of the board. Tim's forces had advanced in a way that he could not use proximity or line of sight since the woods blocked his auxiliaries leader centre point, and the space provided to get both of his units stuck on one large was simply not there.. so Tim wisely back peddled and formed his units into an adjacent formation, so that if the Large unit charged, he'd be forced to taken on both units at once.
You'll also notice that Graham's forces approach the far side of the board. Tim's forces had advanced in a way that he could not use proximity or line of sight since the woods blocked his auxiliaries leader centre point, and the space provided to get both of his units stuck on one large was simply not there.. so Tim wisely back peddled and formed his units into an adjacent formation, so that if the Large unit charged, he'd be forced to taken on both units at once.
Tim also decided to take the initiate to charge the Briton line. It had previously been weakened somewhat by missile fire.
The Legionnaires throwing their pilum and slingers under Gus' control wiped out some Barbarian skirmishers.
In the following round of combat, Tim's Romans wiped out one warband, while Jame's fanatics and cavalry forced back the Roman line on the road.
There were some slow going movements on the right Roman flank, but the Britons were already ploughing there way through the Roman centre.
Failed orders it seems! This is where you wish you had men that listened to you and drank less before a fight.
The chariots supporting the destroyed warband had to give ground! The romans chose not to pursue.
the fighting continues, and that large Warband sits where it is... failed orders? Plans? I don't remember but it did not really get involved in the fighting! Graham's other warband that did not break managed to push back the Legionnaires..
I like these battles.. it's not just one straight battle across the board, there's little bouts going on or about to go down all over the place!
More fighting happened, and most units remained in the same position. But then the Romans that had at first seemed like they were going to lose, seem to have defeated the Warband, AND Chariots that were forcing them back! Miraculously the Barbarian slingers part of that combat did not break.. very brave for the most cowardly unit in the game!
The fighting was still going down on this side, and there were more failed orders than successful ones!
Graham kept his surviving chariots at bay in open order.. to throw things at the Roman lines.
Finally James left flank gets rolling into position.. He pulls back his slingers out of pilum range and gets them ready to help support his warbands.
Tim gives his Legionnaires a group order to switch positions with his Skorpion, and the fight continues deep behind the Roman lines...
And it goes even deeper.. the Romans here get crushed by the Fanatics, but by the time they reach this point, the fanatics are shaken and weary.
Oh, the slingers in the woods drove back the closest warband and forced the chariots to move with them! Good use of skirmishers, Gus!
The fanatics chase the shaken Roman unit right off the board, and they all flee back home, where they are probably crucified for their cowardliness... Now the Romans have a problem.. James men are both behind their lines, and approaching the left flank of waiting legionnaires!
But Tim sends one of his units over to help sandwich the celtic cavalrymen.
James tried to reorder his men into a good position after Gus' slingers had drove back the warband.
Eventually, Graham with his large warband on the far side of the field get tired of holding their position and getting shot at by Tim's auxiliary archers... They pull back and re-position. I guess they did not want to brave on past the woods...
James forces finally get a charge move in.. but end up short of the Roman line! So javelins and things were thrown instead!
Just an inch or so off from connecting! What's wrong with your legs, men?!
Good thing for the Romans - the barbarians behind the line were turned into mince meat , and the threat was removed to face James failed assault.
Will they do anything this game, other than being shot at? The big warband was the scariest, but it didn't do so much!
Here, the Romans are able to concentrate all their fire and re position their ranks.. they were able to drive back all the Barbarians with missile fire!
Time starts to advance on the Barbarian's under Grahams division. The lone chariot unit is probably up to no good, throwing javelins at the skorpion..
Again, James charges, and one of his warband fails to make it! only an inch or so off once more! However, his soldiers on the left are able to turn the Roman Elephant into the toughest jerky they have ever eaten, and sweep right into one of the legionnaires flanks!
And... they destroy that unit.
And this is where we ended the game! We had played for something like 5 and a half hours straight, and it was getting late! We decided to call it a draw.. or was it a minor Roman victory?
Regardless, we never ended the game, nor figured out the winner. Ultimately it seemed that the Romans would have won, since they suffered less wounds and still had so many heavy units, archers, and a skorpion involved. Then again, you never know.. had we continued perhaps the Britons may have carried they day!
Notes, thoughts and discussions had after the game:
I'd like to say that Gus and his skirmishers were really well placed in the trees. They fended off many enemies and hardly moved at all! Similarly, Tim had some medium archers also in the other parts of the woods, dealing damage and driving off warbands...
Tim has cleared up a lot about divisional orders, since in the past I always though that the order given had to be pretty strict, as in, if all units move forth in a straight line, they have to without bumping into each other. Not so! They can move around and switch positions, as long as they all end up with each other in six inches, the order is framed well, and the faster units do not fly on past the slower. It was a good learning experience for me as a spectator, that is for sure.
We're also working out some "house rules" for certain parts of the game. I figured I'd record what we discussed here, since Graham suggested one of us do it. Personally, I like to be as pure as possible to the original rulesets, but I do understand in some scenarios and situations, there is need to make the game more enjoyable for the whole.
We were talking about models just barley touching impassible terrain (we've always forgiven one or two files or one or two guys. when they move through impassible) and I think we've decided that if a unit is something like 40 mm or hardly any of the unit , to just let the edges go.
Also, there is the ongoing discussion amongst some of us about archer units shooting from behind and over friendly units to their fronts. Personally the impassible terrain makes sense, to just forgive a couple units going through to speed up the game, but the archers to me.. I've decided I am on the fence about. While it is perfectly possible for archers to arch a shot over men (and could do so even better, as technology progressed) , I do not believe it was done often.
Bows are not so bad to make, but arrows being shot without accuracy is an expensive, wasteful thing to do. Which archers would want to shoot blind and waste all those arrows? From what I understand, even in the 100 years war, and War of the Roses, Longbowmen still needed to gauge their distance, and would do so from the front of the lines, and pulled back behind men at arms when the enemy got too close. From my reading and experience in other games also, archer units could potentially shoot from behind friendlys only if they were elevated higher at some point, like a hill, or on a castle wall. I know the Dacian supplement of Hail caesar has something about this. Perhaps I should get a copy and introduce that idea to the group?
How I have always pictured battles going, is that typically archery and ranged shots go down first, as the armies draw closer together.. or if an enemy is approaching a fortified position, the archery goes on first.. but when melee and close combat goes on, the ranged attacks shut down almost entirely. It would make more sense to have your ranged guys up front, so they can see directly what they're firing at, lob shot, straight shot, volley, or what have you. Unless of course, they could gauge it from a hill above friends, to properly reach the foe. Artillery works this way in Hail Caesar!
I think that's how Hail Caesar! and history has made use of archers and other ranged units. To have some ranged attacks happen just before the melee goes down, then only continue if the forces split apart. Some cruel leaders may have shot their own men in the past, but I don't think an army commander would want to do that often, unless they are disposed of by their own men! And arrows are expensive.. why shoot blindly from behind your buddies, when you can be at the front, just before the enemy closes in, lob off a whole bunch of shots, then get behind your melee ready fellows.
On the flip side - it is totally possible to do so - shoot over friendly folks at ground level without seeing the enemy! The accuracy would be cut down immensely though, I imagine. And thus we're working on a system to allow for only certain ranged units to do this at specific ranges with decent penalties.
I should say as a side note - I've played so many battles in Total War Games that I'm quite used to shooting over friendly units without line of sight... even slings do it! Even if the archers are at a lower point than their friends, they do it! well.. and friendly fire? Oh am I ever a friend to that! But that is a video game, focused more on gameplay than historical accuracy!
So that was the game and my thoughts! I am glad Gus and James could get a taste of Hail Caesar! They are working on some War of the Roses miniatures and would love to play the game using them. I do believe they will be using some modified house rules to better represent the era, however.
I leave you now with some stuff I've been fixing and working on - Numidians I inherited from Grant and some of my old Agema Romans. Well I repaired them somehow and somewhat... here's what they are now!
And this is where we ended the game! We had played for something like 5 and a half hours straight, and it was getting late! We decided to call it a draw.. or was it a minor Roman victory?
Regardless, we never ended the game, nor figured out the winner. Ultimately it seemed that the Romans would have won, since they suffered less wounds and still had so many heavy units, archers, and a skorpion involved. Then again, you never know.. had we continued perhaps the Britons may have carried they day!
Notes, thoughts and discussions had after the game:
I'd like to say that Gus and his skirmishers were really well placed in the trees. They fended off many enemies and hardly moved at all! Similarly, Tim had some medium archers also in the other parts of the woods, dealing damage and driving off warbands...
Tim has cleared up a lot about divisional orders, since in the past I always though that the order given had to be pretty strict, as in, if all units move forth in a straight line, they have to without bumping into each other. Not so! They can move around and switch positions, as long as they all end up with each other in six inches, the order is framed well, and the faster units do not fly on past the slower. It was a good learning experience for me as a spectator, that is for sure.
We're also working out some "house rules" for certain parts of the game. I figured I'd record what we discussed here, since Graham suggested one of us do it. Personally, I like to be as pure as possible to the original rulesets, but I do understand in some scenarios and situations, there is need to make the game more enjoyable for the whole.
We were talking about models just barley touching impassible terrain (we've always forgiven one or two files or one or two guys. when they move through impassible) and I think we've decided that if a unit is something like 40 mm or hardly any of the unit , to just let the edges go.
Also, there is the ongoing discussion amongst some of us about archer units shooting from behind and over friendly units to their fronts. Personally the impassible terrain makes sense, to just forgive a couple units going through to speed up the game, but the archers to me.. I've decided I am on the fence about. While it is perfectly possible for archers to arch a shot over men (and could do so even better, as technology progressed) , I do not believe it was done often.
Bows are not so bad to make, but arrows being shot without accuracy is an expensive, wasteful thing to do. Which archers would want to shoot blind and waste all those arrows? From what I understand, even in the 100 years war, and War of the Roses, Longbowmen still needed to gauge their distance, and would do so from the front of the lines, and pulled back behind men at arms when the enemy got too close. From my reading and experience in other games also, archer units could potentially shoot from behind friendlys only if they were elevated higher at some point, like a hill, or on a castle wall. I know the Dacian supplement of Hail caesar has something about this. Perhaps I should get a copy and introduce that idea to the group?
How I have always pictured battles going, is that typically archery and ranged shots go down first, as the armies draw closer together.. or if an enemy is approaching a fortified position, the archery goes on first.. but when melee and close combat goes on, the ranged attacks shut down almost entirely. It would make more sense to have your ranged guys up front, so they can see directly what they're firing at, lob shot, straight shot, volley, or what have you. Unless of course, they could gauge it from a hill above friends, to properly reach the foe. Artillery works this way in Hail Caesar!
I think that's how Hail Caesar! and history has made use of archers and other ranged units. To have some ranged attacks happen just before the melee goes down, then only continue if the forces split apart. Some cruel leaders may have shot their own men in the past, but I don't think an army commander would want to do that often, unless they are disposed of by their own men! And arrows are expensive.. why shoot blindly from behind your buddies, when you can be at the front, just before the enemy closes in, lob off a whole bunch of shots, then get behind your melee ready fellows.
On the flip side - it is totally possible to do so - shoot over friendly folks at ground level without seeing the enemy! The accuracy would be cut down immensely though, I imagine. And thus we're working on a system to allow for only certain ranged units to do this at specific ranges with decent penalties.
I should say as a side note - I've played so many battles in Total War Games that I'm quite used to shooting over friendly units without line of sight... even slings do it! Even if the archers are at a lower point than their friends, they do it! well.. and friendly fire? Oh am I ever a friend to that! But that is a video game, focused more on gameplay than historical accuracy!
So that was the game and my thoughts! I am glad Gus and James could get a taste of Hail Caesar! They are working on some War of the Roses miniatures and would love to play the game using them. I do believe they will be using some modified house rules to better represent the era, however.
I leave you now with some stuff I've been fixing and working on - Numidians I inherited from Grant and some of my old Agema Romans. Well I repaired them somehow and somewhat... here's what they are now!
I'm expecting to play a small scaled game with Tim S against his Carthaginians very soon, using this small handful of soldiers. We plan to use what we've got currently painted and do some non-point base games, in the way Hail Caesar! was originally designed for ! Hoping to film those games, and get them on Youtube! Otherwise, you'll see it here on this blog!
Thanks for reading!
Thanks for reading!
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